MabiPro: The Authentic Old-School Mabinogi Experience

Mana Evaporation: Needs to be removed. Forgot this dumb monstrosity was even a thing.

Giants have an easier time training it, because we're melee specialists: True. I was mostly talking about reducing the grind scaling, due to the ridiculous amount of kills that you need to get to rank it up. If you know what you're doing, and cap WM first, it's super easy. If you hit level 300 total before you realize you need it, you're probably f*cked for good. Your suggestion should be implemented for testing:

Invulnerability Frames: Forgot these existed. If that's the case, I'd like to see the HP% scale with how much max HP you have. The more HP you have, the higher the %. You have 400hp, it goes at 10% of total HP. You have 200hp, it's 5% of total HP. 10% may mean that you can WM 10 times before you go deadly, but for new players with low HP, WMing 3-5 times in short succession makes you essentially deadly due to the fact you've only got about 25HP left.

More distance for giants to be able to charge at all ranks: Maybe not distance. Damage reduction increase maybe? Mobility is something that already needs to be addressed, in it's own thread. Mobility is a vastly broken and abusable mechanic. Also, if you take a look at each race page on the Mabinogi Wiki, you can't argue that adding shieldless charge to every race is really going to make the giant any weaker as melee specialists. That's a hell of a lot of positives. But if we bring mobility in line for all races, we may be able to address the weaknesses of other races, bringing Giant's magic weaknesses in line with humans, or giving elves a little more combat ability to bump them up to near-human level. From here, it's all about race-unique skills differentiating them. Giants will still be known as tanky bruisers, elves still as magical arrow fairies, and humans as versatile and able to perform either task.

I don't think lances exist yet. Level 20. Murdering wolves in south Tir Chonail.


Jumping a bit up on the post, archery. Other than just wounds, you may want to consider stun time, speed, upgrades, and honest knockback ability on each shot. While i say knockback, take note i don't mean actual knock down and stuns. I mean each shot slightly pushing a mob back a bit. You'd apply normal stun time, and during 70-80% of the stun time the mob would slide backwards to its final position. Don't make the slide 100% of stun time, as that would likely cause issues with latency. Possibly make it affected by heavy stander or something. Yes, these would require testing. I didn't mean for aim time to remain the same, I figured that would be obviously broken. Stun time, it could work a little closer to Gunslinger's stuns. But as I said, requires testing. They might be better as high-DPS slow load skills with the same stun, or they might be better as moderate-DPS medium-load skills with short stun.

Stun time is obvious, but you could make it vary greatly for each bow. Tweak the bows themselves some to give varying range stun times, as well as give them the ability to affect skill loading time for bow related skills. Let upgrades further tweak each of the prior mentioned effects. This adds an effect of hidden power to weapons. Someone playing on a low end PC might not be able to tell the difference between a LB and a LLB while being arrow revolver-ed into a corner. Stun time needs to be universal, if it can be modified by enchants or upgrades and each bow has a different amount of stun, then there WILL be one bow to rule them all, causing all future balance to revolve around THAT bow.

If bard comes back, lullaby needs carefully monitored. We won't have talents i hope, so reduced effects from music. But that's one skill i'd keep under scrutiny, because it can be all you need to take a deadly situation into a cakewalk. Yes.

Fighter... meh. It was king of single target dps back in its introduction. I'm not opposed to respite having the magic penalty removed, i'm rather impartial to the set as a whole.

Keep hybrid skills out, or in gunner and ninja's case they may need nerfed. Without talents, we do not necessarily have the stats to support efficient use of these skillsets. However, gunner and ninja make crowd control a joke. Also bear in mind, introducing skills means we get more base stats as we train them. Power creep, aside from actual skill usage. If we assign Alchemy an end-game stat, and a stat with levels, we should bring in two more classes to utilize the other two stats. Hybrid skills should never have existed, and should have only had one stat to scale off. I was a well-set mage on live, picked up a pair of pistols and was just obliterated any opponents that weren't in Elite+ with Rank F skills. I would personally put Fighter on Dex or Str, Bard on Int or Dex, Gunner on Int or Str. Adding these classes gives a direction for players to go after they cap one set of skills, and puts their previous stats to good use.

Future content, meteor needs a long cool down. Bear in mind, it's actually not mana intensive, given what it is and what it can do, including using it through walls. A rank 1 also is absurdly strong, with special upgrades, and not even using reforges. I would slowly tweak things here and there if you want to adjust it, but if the damage and aoe stays the same, i would not want the cool down reduced. I would say make it Mana intensive. I could understand a CD of maybe 5m from impact to 10m, but hours? That's crazy talk. Especially when it comes to training the skill. My Thunder did Meteor's job better and more reliably than Meteor, but I was already R1 on that. Hailstorm has pretty much zero CD, but I was still hitting 20k damage per ball of ice. Sure it wasn't a huge AOE, but the spammability gave me more DPS in the long run.

Inspiration i'd really like, but you'd have to monitor mana shield's efficiency and inspiration's cool down to see how well those two play together. Remember, our mana shield now is different than the one in live mabi. I don't think, as a mage, I would like this one. I'd rather have buffed meditation. I could understand maybe a channeled effect that draws in mana from your opponents around you (similar to Boss Life Drain) that deals little or no HP damage, only draws aggro and restores your mana. You can't just fart out some mana and take a deep whiff through the nostrils to restore a chunk of your bar at once. That makes no sense.

Lightning rod is another cause of concern, absurd burst damage with lowish mana usage and relatively short cool down. Honestly, i think the old inter magics; fireball, thunder, icespear, and possibly even blaze should be considered being adjusted in terms of both cast time and mp usage, should we get newer magic. They don't balance properly, other than they have no cool downs. Looked at lightning rod skill videos. Looks dumb. Wow Ice Spear 2: Lightning Edition. Way to creative Devcat. Better idea would have just been to give mages Shock, or summon a Storm Cloud that continuously deals lightning damage to enemies in the area. I don't want this skill.

I really just want to point out, we are not live mabi. Seeking a balance is what we should be doing. We have a foundation for the game. While the original concept is what will draw old fans, maintaining that balance, but possibly improving it, will be what's likely to keep players.

Just what "tree" am I "barking up"? My whole argument has been to implement skills such as Inspiration, to help alleviate the concerns people have expressed regarding MP consumption. And I only wanted to keep mana evaporation so that the skill doesn't get abused, and that I also still believe that a mage should generally only need one of their spells to do enough damage.

I'm not beyond persuasion, if you think that idea in its entirety isn't going to work, tell me why. But so far, I've only seen one person actually acknowledge my idea, everyone else is only calling out my statement on keeping mana evaporation; that isn't going to present a very convincing argument to me.

what's the point of playing in a private server if my 222 broads get chiseled down by some apprentice blacksmith

I like your idea about having seasonal dye set gachapons.

For the dabblers, mana evaporation sounds rather fair. Bolts and basic heal are all fine to use (though you won't be able to chain cast without a wand), but going beyond that is a big decision.
As one who usually plays pure-mage, I'm tempted to hop on hating the dabblers to get it changed for pures, but I need to address this for dabblers. Mana costs are an easy gate for this. Does anything outside of the mage tree even give mana? Intelligence maybe, on Musical Knowledge. With dabblers having an estimated 50-100 mana, I don't see them being able to utilize many higher level spells.

Keeping mana evaporation around makes it so the higher level spells are for someone who is dedicated to using magic. Without it, we might start coming across dabblers that could possibly even outperform pure mages, saving their spells for when they matter (like Wights) and using their other combat skills to handle everything else.
Hybrids are always stronger towards end-game than pures. That's just how it goes. Alchemy and Magic, both would benefit from ranking defense (due to equipping a shield with their wand/cylinder), windmill for when enemies get close, really the only thing you don't necessarily need to dabble in is life or ranged attack as a mage/alchemist. That being said, Alchemists can change cylinders with no downside, and I am certainly vying for them to have an end-game stat rather than leaving them flatlined. Should Stamina-evaporation be implemented if Alchemists get an end game stat? If your answer is no, then magic doesn't need it either.

That being said, Mages need a tune-up somewhere. That's for sure. I'm really liking Cyrene's ideas for magic weapons. More and weaker wand options would allow a steady progression through the magic tree. Mana potions should somehow be purchasable from NPC vendors (10's and 30's, of course), both for newcomers to magic and for veterans so they don't always have to use potion making or buy from other players. These are good options, but if you REALLY want to keep "mana evaporation" as it is, it's completely destructive to PURE mages, which you argued for, and not destructive to DABBLERS, which you argued against, as it takes ALL of your mana other than your Title-related mana and mana boosting items. I'd suggest a flat 50-100 MP drain IF IT MUST EXIST, while equipping another wand could maybe replenish 50-100 of lost MP?

If we're looking for new ideas, maybe we could consider pets in some way? Familiars tend to be a common theme in the fantasy of magic, and since pets are now obtainable through red coins instead of money, everyone has equal access to them. Or maybe a skill that would allow you to draw the mana from an ally into yourself? Players would have to provide consent, and it would likely not be a mid-combat sort of skill, but allies who aren't making use of their mana could give it to their mage who is. Or you could go the other route and have a skill that would allow you to give mana to someone else. What would be the benefit of ranking a skill that allows you to give others your mana? Would it increase your Dex, if you're an archer? Str if you're a warrior? Does it reduce your CP? Why even rank this? Screw our mage man, just let our Alchemist handle it. As for the pets, I'm down for Familiars, I suggested that for Pally/DK active skills instead of Cntrol of Darkness and Not Applicable. But if Familiars become a thing, they'll need to be a skill, separate from pets. Pets need a re-vamp, but we shouldn't be forcing pets to certain classes. Wow, look at my warrior galloping off on his str-boosting horse to the next dungeon room. Meanwhile I'm waiting for my mana-restoration Seal to scoot it's fat posterior in range of me to give me my mana back. I'd suggest something like the mini-pets as Familiars, summonable through a skill, and doesn't take up a summon space so you can still summon your real pet. I'd also make the Familiar you summon RNG the first time, then remain the same familiar every time (unless you purchase a Familiar reset scroll using Fomor Coins). Have them all apply the same bonus to MP regen and whatnot, but aesthetically some are more desirable than others.

You don't take 222 broadswords to apprentice blacksmiths? 222 broadswords are really good weapons. What's the point of playing the private server that promotes itself under being "Authentic Old-School Mabinogi experience" you ask? Well it's certainly not to experience an easier version of the actual game. In the same way you don't play s4max and hope to play an easier version of s4 league, no you're going to experience what the game was.


I'll state the same opinion again, durability does serve a purpose. It keeps weapons as a resource, something to make combat easier, but they aren't forever, which in turn keeps blacksmithing and other life skills purposeful to the same people. And you don't need a good weapon to do significant damage in a game where your stats come mainly from your character. It also forces you to adapt, sometimes changing your playstyle because hey, you're lacking resources, so you can't necessarily fund your best shit right now, maybe put it in the bank and grab something else. This isn't wow where dungeons and quests turn into gear checks, this is a game where understanding the mechanics will take you much further. Playing smart and adapting instead of pressing rotations and moving out of the fire. This also reinforces the fact that weapons are resources, they don't take long to upgrade, you could potentially have an endgame weapon from the start, but if you can't afford to repair it or replace it, what are you doing? It can serve it's purpose, but it can serve that purpose without permanently destroying your favorite gear. Max durability needs to be recoverable, whether through sacrificing other weapons of same quality, or through expensive repairs, it still forces you to bank that weapon and change your play until you can afford the repairs. There are two enchant slots on each item, and you can only burn one enchant off as it stands. Along with upgrades and red and blue stones, the time and money put into your favorite gear should not be 100% destroyed by losing MAX durability permanently.

Now you bring up the example of melee weapons being expensive and having other cheaper options, which magic doesn't
(Though, not sure why you picked gladius or battle swords, because those really aren't the cheap options. Something like fluted shorts or wooden blades make a lot more sense here, but I digress.) Still cheaper than wands. 40k base cost vs 10k base cost.
There are other options to fix the magic user weapon costs by adding cheaper and weaker weapons which have weaker upgrade paths as well, or rely on artisans for decent damage, like maxing the upgrades to cc3 instead of 4, and so on. Make a weapon called the basic/flimsy wand of Fire, just reuse the basic fire wand model, neuter the upgrade options, lower the value to make it cheaper to upgrade and repair/use. While the other weapons, stay as they are, giving you the same level of choice as other skillsets have.I'm not against lower-cost entry-level mage weapons. But you don't think right now the weapons for mages are a little costly? If you're a pure mage, you're casting spells left and right, your durability goes down far faster than your gold income. If you're a dabbler, you're using other equipment and weapons, cheaping out on other options where you can and by the time your wand needs a repair, you've amassed plenty of currency. 10 Durability on each wand gives you roughly 4k per point of repair. Broad sword has 12 Durability, and costs almost 4k. That's 300g per point. Now throw on some good late-game enchants, you increase your repair cost on each by, let's say 5x. That's still only 1.5k for one point of a Broad, meanwhile a mage pays 20k for a single point. That's crazy man.